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   Descent BB Forum Index > Ethics and Commentary > Suit & Tie are just Burquas for men Post new topic   Reply to topic
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roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2010 4:56 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Suits, ties, button-up shirts, pressed trousers.
In our culture just try to get an office job without them, pfff good luck.
Their primacy function is to make men look boring.
In western culture, they basically serve the function as Burqas for men.
I hate suits and ties.



This image actually came up when i was searching for images for this topic. Leunig, fuck yeah!

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
Floyd
Hotshot




PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2010 1:29 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Paul kept his individuality Wink

http://mthruf.com/2010/09/16/job-lols-paul-kept-mostly-to-himself/
AlphaDoG
porn 'n beans




PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 12:06 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

LOL nice!
TechPro
Hotshot




PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 10:44 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

roid wrote:
Suits, ties, button-up shirts, pressed trousers.
In our culture just try to get an office job without them, pfff good luck.
Their primacy function is to make men look boring.
In western culture, they basically serve the function as Burqas for men.
I hate suits and ties.

Totally agree with you there. The person who came up with the notion that men should wear ties in order to appear "professional" should be taken out, strung up (by ties) by various portions of anatomy, and be slowly (very slowly) pulled into heavy machinery by the tie fastened around ... someplace tender.

No malice here.
Zuruck
Ace




PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:26 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

I've worn a suit and tie to work since I've been 22. No big deal for me, actually kind of like it. Granted, there isn't much variety but it looks clean and professional.

Would rather a suit and tie than a polo shirt and chinos any day.
Bunyip
DBB Staff




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 6:07 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

To OP:

Suits actually serve exactly the OPPOSITE purpose of the Burqa. The oppression goes the other way - from the wearer to the non-wearer. They are a uniform which says "I am someone who is powerful, serious, and who demands respect". They serve to separate the businessman from the tradesman, the executive from the common worker.

Zuruck wrote:
Would rather a suit and tie than a polo shirt and chinos any day.


Not if you had my job you wouldn't. Business casual to smart casual is the way to go for any occasion - because you never know when you're going to be spending an hour or more in the Florida sun, so it's all relative I'd say.

_________________
BELIEVE NOTHING, no matter where you read it, or who has said it,
not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason
and your own common sense. - GAUTAMA BUDDHA
Pun
DBB Admin




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 1:26 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

I could wear a suit or business casual in my job. I prefer business casual.
Zuruck
Ace




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 2:43 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

I just think a polo shirt and khaki pants looks tacky Bun. Kind of reminds me of the people that put a loud muffler and a spoiler on a Honda Civic.
Floyd
Hotshot




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 3:31 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Zuruck wrote:
I just think a polo shirt and khaki pants looks tacky Bun. Kind of reminds me of the people that put a loud muffler and a spoiler on a Honda Civic.

i always pictured such people with orange pants and ed hardy t-shirts.
TheWhat
Insane!




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:51 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Zuruck wrote:
I just think a polo shirt and khaki pants looks tacky Bun. Kind of reminds me of the people that put a loud muffler and a spoiler on a Honda Civic.


What is a booty and how do I know if I'm shakin' it?

Suits can look great on people, so can Izods. How is this in ethics and commentary? fucking die slowly if you don't like the way I look.

_________________
Richard Dawkins stole my woman with his big evolved dick.
Bunyip
DBB Staff




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:36 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

LOL @ Floyd. You're so right about the douche-wear.

Adam: Did you read the OP? There's some commentary...Oh and while I'm at it, I have some commentary too: Let me just say that personally I think you'd look better in a dark pinstriped zoot suit than in that goodwill trash I see you wearing. Padded Shoulders, pegged pants, extra-wide lapels and two tone shoes. A pocket watch on a long chain. Twirl that bad boy. Now we're talking.

Zuruck wrote:
I just think a polo shirt and khaki pants looks tacky Bun.


In the wrong setting, sure. On the other hand you'd just look like an idiotic stuffed shirt out at the jobsite. It's all about context. Remember that there are practical reasons for a lot of this stuff that you so disdainfully dismiss, when it's really the abuses that you abhor.

I dress down or up as necessary, although I only wear suits to weddings and funerals anymore...(Florida is about as casual as it gets, for obvious reasons)

_________________
BELIEVE NOTHING, no matter where you read it, or who has said it,
not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason
and your own common sense. - GAUTAMA BUDDHA
Zuruck
Ace




PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 8:55 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Heh meat...I think we're talking about work attire bro...you can wear a grocery bag and it's good in my book.

I think my disdain for polo shirts comes from the few jobs I had when I was a bit younger that did those casual Fridays. That would have been great and all except they made us wear company polos and they were fucking horrible. Not only were they made of the cheapest cotton available, but they were just plain ugly.
roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 3:55 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Zuruck wrote:
casual Fridays....
That would have been great and all except they made us wear company polos


wtf. should call it Uniform Fridays.

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
Woodchip
Ace




PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:27 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Ford Motor Company required all its male employee's to wear suits....until they ran a cost efficiency. test and found people dressed casually are more productive. Now suit and tie is not required.
dissent
Hotshot




PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:56 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Zuruck wrote:
I've worn a suit and tie to work since I've been 22. No big deal for me, actually kind of like it. Granted, there isn't much variety but it looks clean and professional.

I'm with Zuruck here; not that I wear one, but for some types of work they are quite appropriate. I like the way Bun characterized it - "They are a uniform ...". Sometimes a well pressed uniform is the best choice.

_________________
It is a mistake to think businessmen are more immoral than politicians - John Maynard Keynes
roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 10:26 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Can you give an example of why a uniform is good?

- The only useful uniforms i've seen are those that are either exclusive (can't be bought) and thus make up a kindof wearable access control system for the organisation. And example of this can be school uniforms.
- Another useful purpose of a uniform is to provide a practical functional aide to the person's job - ie: has a lot of pockets, protects against the sun, or helps keep a clean-room clean.

Neither of these apply to offices. So what is the true purpose of this uniform?

Zuruck wrote:
Granted, there isn't much variety but it looks clean and professional.
This is also why people wear Burquas, because "Natural women are too distracting".
In our culture - it seems that natural men are too distracting.

Also a major point i wanted to bring attention to is how women's suits are more liberal than men's suits. This gender gap being further evidence that that in our culture - this is indeed a garment of oppression forced on MEN.

Plenty of women like wearing the Burqua - they internalise the repression, they think it's correct, that women should be hidden, that society would not function otherwise. It's clean, it's professional, it's not human.

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
Zuruck
Ace




PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:48 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

jesus dude lay off the kool aid.

a fucking suit is no where close to a goddamn burqua. they are completely different. a suit is an extremely professional piece of attire, why it's the business norm to wear them i can't tell you, but they are it. but saying they're like burquas is just pretty stupid man.

but that's what happens when you try to rationalize religion...dont make sense.
Zuruck
Ace




PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:49 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

why all the rage on the suit?

get turned down for a job because they didn't like you wearing shorts and a t shirt at the interview and it wasn't fair? suck it up jackass
roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:32 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Your abusing me - defending a concept you admittedly know nothing about - must be some kindof odd knee-jerk reaction:
Zuruck wrote:
a suit is an extremely professional piece of attire, why it's the business norm to wear them i can't tell you, but they are it
although loud - your ignorance doesn't actually bring anything to the discussion Sad, it doesn't help at all, stop waving it around.

You should probably also define what "professional" means to you - and what it should mean to me.


Zuruck wrote:
but that's what happens when you try to rationalize religion...dont make sense.
*sigh* You have interpreted this thread all backwards.
I'm not using Burquas as a metaphor for something good that could/should be rationalised away.
I'm using Burquas as a metaphor for something bad, a symbol of forced oppression.

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
Bunyip
DBB Staff




PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 4:40 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

I shall repeat-

Bunyip wrote:
To OP:

Suits actually serve exactly the OPPOSITE purpose of the Burqa. The oppression goes the other way - from the wearer to the non-wearer. They are a uniform which says "I am someone who is powerful, serious, and who demands respect". They serve to separate the businessman from the tradesman, the executive from the common worker.


"Suits" are lineal descendents of nobleman's clothing. Quite simply put they are the tribal wear of the elite. Burquas are garments whose purpose is to oppress, suits are meant to do quite the opposite. They allow the commons to aspire to nobility in the form of imitation.

Your idea, while interesting and somewhat well-thought out, is most likely incorrect as the facts do not bear out your hypothesis. In fact, it appears to be more of a self-serving rationalization, as you even explicitly state that you hate suits and ties. At a guess, this is why you, in particular, feel oppressed by suits.

Thus the reaction from the stiff-neck brigade.

_________________
BELIEVE NOTHING, no matter where you read it, or who has said it,
not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason
and your own common sense. - GAUTAMA BUDDHA
roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:09 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

You count the inanities of conspicuous consumption, and pointless class conflict - as positives? Surprised

I don't want to ban Suits. I don't want to ban Burquas.
You can still wear them if you want, i won't be offended.
I just want the institutionalised expectation of such garments erased from society. As far as i can tell there are no valid reasons for these expectations. There are some industries within society where active resistance against suits is more common (artistic creative industries, information technology, etc). It's not just me.

You have good points explaining why suits are common - but not why they should be expected or respected.

Are White/Blue/Etc collars fashion rules & rigid social classes - or are they mere harmless traversable metaphors to do with as we wish?
Can't we be androgynous Chess boxers if we wish? When i'm doing my taxes at home should i put on a tie? Why must we pigeon-hole our fellow-man.
Are we not men?

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
dissent
Hotshot




PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 7:26 am View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

roid wrote:
You count the inanities of conspicuous consumption, and pointless class conflict - as positives? Surprised

I don't want to ban Suits. I don't want to ban Burquas.
You can still wear them if you want, i won't be offended.
I just want the institutionalised expectation of such garments erased from society.

Hey, good luck with that one. There have always been certain norms for clothing within groups. They change over time and culture. you're butting your head against human nature to try to get people to not care about where they fit in to their social group. Humans are social animals. Clothing is one way to reflect that.

Quote:
As far as i can tell there are no valid reasons for these expectations. There are some industries within society where active resistance against suits is more common (artistic creative industries, information technology, etc). It's not just me.

of course, if you have NO norms for dress in various social contexts, then you'd be out of luck - there would be few ways for an individual to stand out in the crowd by dressing a different way if EVERYONE is dressing in a different way.

Quote:
You have good points explaining why suits are common - but not why they should be expected or respected.

because it's a cultural norm, at least for the present. 200 years from now, who knows? (Look at what people were wearing in various contexts 200 years ago - certainly different than today.


Quote:
Why must we pigeon-hole our fellow-man.

sorry dude. that's part of being human. You're stuck with your species, I'm afraid.

_________________
It is a mistake to think businessmen are more immoral than politicians - John Maynard Keynes
Neo
[deleted]




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 1:59 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

dissent wrote:
Hey, good luck with that one. There have always been certain norms for clothing within groups. They change over time and culture. you're butting your head against human nature to try to get people to not care about where they fit in to their social group. Humans are social animals. Clothing is one way to reflect that.


Is this human nature? or human behavior?

suits look nice, I don't care what anyone says. =P

Zuruck wrote:
you try to rationalize religion


In case there was any doubt that zuruck is oblique. =P He thinks roid would try to rationalize religion. =P
Zuruck
Ace




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 4:52 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Neo wrote:
dissent wrote:
Hey, good luck with that one. There have always been certain norms for clothing within groups. They change over time and culture. you're butting your head against human nature to try to get people to not care about where they fit in to their social group. Humans are social animals. Clothing is one way to reflect that.


Is this human nature? or human behavior?

suits look nice, I don't care what anyone says. =P

Zuruck wrote:
you try to rationalize religion


In case there was any doubt that zuruck is oblique. =P He thinks roid would try to rationalize religion. =P


If there was any doubt that you're a complete idiot....do you think I meant you directly to roid? or just you as in perception as a whole? think about it for two seconds you fucking idiot
Flip
Ace




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:19 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

Dem dere senstive ass mofo's dont eben played da game. Go die Razz
Bunyip
DBB Staff




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:22 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

now we have 2 of them?

HELP!

_________________
BELIEVE NOTHING, no matter where you read it, or who has said it,
not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason
and your own common sense. - GAUTAMA BUDDHA
roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 9:42 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

der faggots are tryin to break up my clean professional creases with their sissy fashion. How ever will i do my hard werkin chob with all these creaseless faggots distractering me with their tie-less naked necks? Letting bitches into the workplace sure was a slippery slope - next they'll be wearing pants.
Get a haircuts liberal retards!

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
Flip
Ace




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 9:48 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

You worthless polo shirt wearing, koolaid drinking piece of shit. Your a fuckin dumbass. Just saying.
roid
Inane!




PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 10:03 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

polo shirts - as yet another unshakable de-facto casual conservative fashion gatekeeper - are prettymuch just as bad. Orginally created by upperclass elitists who only want to be surrounded by other douches who like them who own tennis courts and polo horses - now we're all expected to want to emulate them? Voluntarily?

They are guarding all the doors, they are holding all the keys.

ie:
Zuruck wrote:
casual Fridays....
That would have been great and all except they made us wear company polos


I have a large collection of suits, ties and buttoned shirts from churchs and white collar jobs i have attended in my past, and a collection of polo shirts from my various blue collar jobs.

_________________
i'm here to ... uh,
Neo
[deleted]




PostPosted: Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:24 pm View user's profile Reply with quote Send private message

I think this thread suits this forum quite well. ^_~

Zuruck wrote:
RAWR, snarl


"You're an idiot" ...how original.

You're still oblique. =P

The subject of this thread is one of the most ridiculous statements I've ever heard.
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